10/12/2017 Open Thread: Boys to Men

Good Morning Gentlemen.

J. Nyx is currently indisposed dealing with some work issues so we’re leaving today’s post as an open thread to discuss what skills and knowledge should be taught to boys before they reach the age of 18.

Annnnnd…..go!

Author: Jak

Jak, married and father of three, seeks to help the Red-Pill Community take its next step past the petty cynicism and ineffectual anger. While he recognizes that men are significantly handicapped by the modern legal system and culture, he doesn't accept that traditional marriage is untenable in today's social climate. Rather, men must be willing to adapt to this new world by implementing new tactics and approaches to maintaining a balance of power. Jak is here to provide you with these lessons.

  • NemesisEnforcer

    I suspect many will focus on hard skills like fishing, camping, fighting, etc… Nothing wrong with that, but let me offer some suggestions for skills that are not strictly physical:

    Critical thinking. Easy to do. Always ask “why,” demand an answer, and teach him to do the same.

    Courage. It is not the absence of fear. It is the learned ability to suppress and overcome fear.

    Tact. Refer to the choose your battles article from a few days ago, and add in the element of how to fight those battles wisely.

    Resilience. When he falls down, teach him to get back up.

    Determination. Don’t let him quit. Teach him to embrace failure as part of a learning process and show him that failures can lead to success if you harness the lessons they deliver.

    • Nice. I’ll just add onto this then:
      Self-reliance. More than breaking free from dependency on others, teach him to be his first go-to guy on his problems and challenges. If he doesn’t know how then he can always learn…

      …Thirst for knowledge. Knowledge is power and kids have a tendency to start thinking they know everything, the problem with this (aside from the obvious) is that it causes them to stop learning. You also don’t want him to see improvement of his mind as a chore or a bore.

      How to spot a con. Whether a get rich quick scheme, cult, some media propaganda/ads, or a flaky girl trying to use him. He needs to know how to spot it and to deal with it…

      …Honesty. A man is only as good as his word and he has to follow through when he gives it.

    • Joseph Curwen

      Excellent list, and I’ll add one:

      Moral. A set of adequate and logical moral values, with clear distinctions between right and wrong, good and evil.

    • John Galt

      Good answers. If I could build on that..

      Inquistiveness. Overcome apathy and build up your knowledge– it’s a life long process. It’s ok to not know something, but refusing to learn when the opportunitey presents itself is on them.

      Basic mechanics. Learn how to problem solve and use the tools (eg. household appliances, cars, electonics, etc…) to fix things.

      Fireams. They don’t need to like them, but teach them basic markmanship and require them to know the functions and how to safely operate a firearm. They may never touch another again, but at least they know how to safely handle one.

      • NemesisEnforcer

        Your last one is something I always point out to my leftoid anti-gun friends. You may hate firearms with all your being, but you don’t know who has one in their closet. Boys will be boys. If they find one, they are in a very dangerous situation if they don’t know how to use it and how dangerous it can be. Your kid needs to understand firearms and firearm safety, not just so he can kill the bad guys or whatever, but so he can recognize when his friend is doing something stupid that could get someone killed and either intervene to make the situation safe, or get the fuck out of there to protect himself. I tell them that not teaching their kids about the safe use and handling of firearms is equivalent to not teaching them how to safely use and handle ovens, knives or power tools. Catastrophically shortsighted and stupid.

        • John Galt

          Exactly. Teach them how to release the clip/ wheel and clear the chamber after beating into them you must treat a firearm like it is always loaded.

          Bolstering your point: Years ago some dumbass was waving around a .32 automatic at a party showing it off. He said it wasn’t loaded. I grabbed it from him, dropped the (empty) clip and pulled back the slide just to have a round jack out. He inadvertently left one in the pipe. Never underestimate stupid people.

          • NemesisEnforcer

            Situations like this call for immediate intervention and public shaming. Act like a dumb ass, get treated like a dumb ass.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            His .32 auto used a clip? Weird. Last gun I saw using clips was an SKS and an M-1 Garand. 🙂

          • John Galt

            Such a purist.
            Clip, magazine. Boot, trunk. AR15, weapon of mass destruction.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Lol! I thrive on being pedantic. It’s my hobby.

          • bem

            Automatics……
            Had a similar occurrence with my asshole friend and his dad’s “unloaded” .45…..

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Anybody brandishing a weapon at a party should automatically be taken as being utterly unfamiliar with firearms.

          • bem

            and then taken out back and whupped.

          • A year or two ago, some moron was banned from a hookah lounge for discharging a .45 round from his brand-new Glock into a chair.

            Not only was this idiot who had never held a gun in his life somehow the owner of a pistol (which, according to my favorite gun shop owners, they would not have sold to a freshly-minted 18 year old without giving him safety training that he clearly never got), but he had a chambered round in the thing while carrying it in a makeshift holster. Sat down on in his chair and Barney Fifed himself.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            You can’t legally buy a pistol at 18 (from a certified FFL dealer I mean, you can buy one from your friends or whatever), so the gun shop owner was not only morally negligent, but legally as well. You can buy rifles and shotguns at 18, but not pistols.

          • The way I hear it, it was a “gift” from someone. I hold them accountable for arming this dunce, not the gun shop owner who, odds are, had not a clue that the gun would be given away irresponsibly.

          • John Galt

            “Sat down on in his chair and Barney Fifed himself.”

            Accidental discharges. Seen it happen.

          • He’d apparently had the gun for two hours. Carrying one in the chamber into a crowded area without having fired it is, to me, the height of irresponsibility.

            I know security guards and gun enthusiasts who hang out there. They carry openly every time they go in, but they take precautions against accidental discharge by using carefully designed holsters (that protect the trigger and lock the gun in place) and carrying “safe” guns (with trigger safeties and a safety on).

            For extra protection, I hear, they’ll even make sure they don’t have a round chambered.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Holster retention, yes.

            Carrying without a round in the chamber is foolish however. When you open carry (which I do quite often) you are advertising directly that you are armed so anybody wanting to get the drop on you will do so with utmost speed. Having to take the time to draw, then effectively jack the slide before being able to line up and aim can be fatal when seconds count.

          • They do it at the door as a sign of good faith for the hippy owners. There have been muggings and shootings in the area (college town – what can you do?) so they don’t ban guns outright, but they’re still touchy leftists.

            Fortunately they don’t know that half their patrons are legally carrying concealed.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Honestly I’d rather conceal carry any day of the week, rather than not have a round in the pipe.

          • I’m with you, there.

          • bem
        • Joseph Curwen

          “(…) I always point out to my leftoid anti-gun friends”

          They are not your friends. A leftist will throw you under the bus in a heartbeat if they have to choose between their insane beliefs and you.

          • NemesisEnforcer

            Haha. Good point.

      • For the more physical skills, then the two here (mechanics and firearms) are a perfect start, I’d add:
        Some sort of fighting/martial art. Boxing is a great foundation to build onto with other disciplines and perfectly good on its own as well.

        Dancing. It will help with coordination (such as say, footwork for boxing), girls, and overall health.

        Survivalist training. Not to the extreme but knowing how to purify/collect water, spot poisonous flora, start a fire, cook, build a shelter, improvise a weapon or tool, blend in in plain sight, and other such skills can serve him very well in life.

        The three R’s (reading, writing, arithmetic). Don’t depend on schools (they are indoctrination centers anyway), a deeper grasp of these will not only help his quest for knowledge, but the more enthusiastic he is to read, the more well-read he’ll become, the more verbose, the more likely to have less trouble communicating (especially with girls). And math will help him with everything from finances to time-management. (All three will improve his ability to think as well).

        • NemesisEnforcer

          Survivalist training is a good one, and one that is particularly easy to incorporate into everyday life without making a big production of it. Hell, standing around at the bus stop in the morning, you can point out which weeds are edible or pose what-if scenarios to get him thinking proactively about what he would do if faced with problems. I do this kind of thing all them time. Whenever I see something while we are out walking around, I point it out to my kids and give them a quick tutorial. Takes all of 30 seconds, and it consistently surprises me how much of it they retain.

          • My dad suggested a leaf collection when I was small. I thought it was a fun game to collect the leaves and then look them up in a book we had while pinning them in an album and then writing up a little about each one (including some of my own thoughts [the sneaky devil] and the scientific name). At the time, I remembered most all of it.
            But it was sort of ingenious the way he had me learning it (the repetition and writing of it and all) and I only later realized it was like something Mr. Miyagi might do. Did the same with birds and snakes. It paid off later in Scouts too.

        • John Galt

          Boxing and dancing. Good choices. If you could take the lads camping, I could see where you could tie in some survivalist training and let them do it hands on.

          I admit I was never much of a hunter, but I humbly asked to join some acquaitances once on a deer hunting trip to learn how to properly skin a deer. They were a bit shocked I’de asked, but were delighted showing me the ropes.

          • jammyjaybird

            I’m looking for a hunting group too. I’d like to learn the ropes.

          • John Galt

            The intital contact was a classmate of mine who looks like he fell out of a skoal advertisement. LOL. Good guys, but they were rednecks through-and-through.

          • How did they show you to skin your deer? I like the “stake the pelt to the ground and use the hoisting winch to pull the deer from its hide” technique.

            For bonus redneck points, use a pulley and your trailer hitch to hoist the deer.

          • John Galt

            Thats a great idea. I’m from a rural area with a lot of fields and woods, so we simply through it in the truck and took it back to guys house, hoisted it up by it’s hind legs from a tree and cut. Nothing fancy.

          • That’s what we used to do, but my uncle spends pretty much all of his free time hunting and picked up a trick or twelve over the years. We stole the idea from him, and it definitely speeds things up.

            Another idea we stole: use the scoop attachment on the family tractor as a basin to catch all the icky bits. When you’re done, you just drive the tractor to the burn pile and toss them there to be burned.

          • John Galt

            That day we weren’t in any hurry. Cold beer doesn’t drink itself you know.

            *Scoop attachment is another good idea. Thanks!

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            A good way to get introduced to hunting groups is to attend an NRA sponsored hunting safety course. It’s mostly all kids, but Dad and Uncle Bob also are present most of the time in the back of the room, and you can network with them and maybe get invited to a hunt. Seen it happen before with my own eyes. The courses themselves are apolitical, they care only about instructing on gun safety and hunting safety and etiquette and the laws surrounding those topics. Just a suggestion if you’re open to it.

          • Another great way is to get yourself to the range. If you make friends with gun shop owners and shooters, you’ll find more hunting groups than you can possibly join.

        • bem

          Great fundamentals, all.

    • Consolation_of_Philosophy

      Humility, and control of pride. Nothing makes a boy quit a new challenge faster than having his pride bruised by a steep learning curve. Getting over one’s self is key to learning anything difficult. This is a big issue for younger people today, because they are indoctrinated (and marketed to) by the idea that they are already great. Any difficult task that calls their current skillset into question is treated as a personal insult. For me, this is the single most important barrier to education.

      • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

        Getting over one’s self is key to learning anything difficult.

        This should be inscribed over the entrance to every institution of learning in the world. Such a simple concept yet one that 95% of the world can’t master.

        • bem

          I like to tell young’uns in the office they’ll go much further if they take the WORK seriously and THEMSELVES less seriously.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        I know I tend to return to lifting and the gym a bit too often, but I will say that the Strict Overhead Press (Military Press) is a good way to remind yourself that you aint shit in the gym. Keep on pulling those big deadlifts, benches and squats…200,300,400 pounds and more. Enjoy. Go load up 135 on that bar and lets see 10 strict OH presses. For me at least it reminds me whats what

        • I like the implied danger of the Military Press. The way that bar quivers overhead as I strain not to be brained by the weight always makes me viscerally aware of my own mortality.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I feel very much the same. Also, the temptation to bend the knees because you know you will have 30% or more power that way but knowing you can’t is important. That mental challenge of knowing that a slight movement can make it easier but you refuse to do it because you are going to be an honest dealer…not with others but with yourself…is amazing. It is just you and the weights.

        • Consolation_of_Philosophy

          My rear delts suck. Fronts are all jacked by comparison. Because I avoid the military press.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Mil press is king but for rear delts you can do bent over back flyers 5×20 @9.5 RPE

  • bem
  • bem

    Pragmatism: You cant negotiate, fight, or whine your way out of physical reality. “This is THIS!”

    • CPR! (common sense, pragmatism, realism) and of course cardiac pulmonary resuscitation is useful too.

    • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

      I prefer practicality. Pragmatism is a philosophy that voids the notion of good/bad (outside of achieving a particular result).

      • bem

        A subtlety worth considering. Though in matters beyond human interaction, good/bad is irrelevant. Like trying to change a tire or start a fire in the rain – you either make it happen or you don’t. Right, wrong, intentions, experience, luck….none of it matters.

  • EastsideProphet

    Also building on what I see here so far, I’d add leadership skills – that being a leader isn’t about being a d-bag that shoves orders, but is about setting an example, teaching, and sacrificing. Show him how this is relevant at home and at work.

    Integrity and its importance in all arenas of life.

  • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

    When running from a train never stop for the fat kid

    • bem

      However, if escaping from a gulag, ALWAYS bring a fat kid. Good Eatin’ when things go south.

      • Plus they’re the only ones who can effectively do the truffle shuffle. Keeps morale up.

        • bem

          and you’ll never want for a comb!

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            poor Gordo…

          • bem

            poor?!??! did you SEE that castle he lived in when he grew up and became Richard Dreyfus?

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            my bad…poor…Vern?

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)
    • NemesisEnforcer

      Easily one of the most traumatic scenes from my childhood. I also remember being very disturbed when they finally found Ray Brower’s body.

    • Honey Badger

      You don’t have to be the fastest kid, just faster than the slowest.

      Also, speaking from experience, they’re ain’t nothing like a goddamn 5,000 ton freight train coming your way to motivate you to jump from a bridge into the water below.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        isn’t that the old joke of the guy who goes camping with his wife and brings a .22 incase they run into a bear. She says “you can’t kill a bear with a .22” and he says, “yeah but once I shoot you in the leg I will have plenty of time to get away”

  • bem

    and if course:

    • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

      You fuckers channeling Pabst the last few days, or what?

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        Only Asians can channel……

        • bem

          and Pabst shall never “channel” an Asian.

      • dckhead_con_artist

        I would never channel cheap beer, only drink it after mowing down a slider at White Castle.

      • bem

        My “memory” is a jumble of movies and TV……

    • Got some of their songs on the rotation for when female “guests” are over:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9GJvl2GdMk

  • EastsideProphet
    • Consolation_of_Philosophy

      It’s the “burden of performance.”

  • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

    In all seriousness, teach your kids that money is the most important fucking thing because it buys freedom. Any kid who grows up with any form of idealism at this point will be lost.

    • bem

      I would substitute ambition for greed in this reading. Further, I’d say money buys ‘options’ not necessarily freedom.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        Ambition is excellent of course and maybe greed is the wrong word kinda maybe sorta but kids ought to know from an early age that money is of the utmost importance and that “how one wants to live” is far more important than what one wants to be. Cut throat capitalism instilled at a very young age would do a world of good over other billshit

        • bem

          “”how one wants to live” is far more important than what one wants to be”
          Absolutely – we’ve covered this before and I couldn’t agree more.

        • dckhead_con_artist

          Should they watch American Greed marathons on the Learning Channel ?

          • bem

            they should use the TV as a rifle target.

    • NemesisEnforcer

      I personally don’t know that I would classify it as the “most important,” but it is very near the top. And it does buy freedom. And there is nothing wrong with idealism per se, but the naive focus on money as evil and philanthropy as good is idiotic. Zuckerberg’s charity does not have your best interests at heart and is actively conspiring and working to fuck you over. The greedy oil company makes your life immeasurably better, all because they are chasing that dollar.

      • Yep. Idealism taken to extremes is zealotry and always terrible.
        Naivete paired with idealism usually ends up like this:

        Wherein you have people arguing for something that causes the very thing they claim to be against with absolutely no capability to recognize it. A “pre-programmed thought for every occasion”.

        • John Galt

          That was painful to watch. The leftist justifies his totalarian ideology with moral certainity that he has the correct view, ignores questions, cast acquasations and then walks from the stage with his tail between his legs.

          • I haven’t watched it, but I know Sargon is a bit of a leftist (he’s the bearded fellow there). He’s not the totalitarian of which you speak, is he?

          • Nope. I would think the other guy to be a parody or caricature if someone described this back and forth to me instead of my seeing it with my own eyes. There’s actually a point where he claims “intersectionalism” is about the individual, you know, that placing a person in groups consisting of things like immutable characteristics it better allows for feminism to acknowledge the various aspects of people.
            He loves the idea that when “there’s a tie between equal candidates for a position” that it go to the person belonging to the “oppressed identity group” at the expense of any white male, since white men and men in general can’t be oppressed or discriminated against, his answer is to openly discriminate against them as a matter of policy.
            And of course, the greatest concern is who is “more (or most) oppressed,” especially if you look back a hundred or more years and confine your examinations to one country.

          • A pity. I liked the Mythicists when they streamed with Bearing, largely because they seemed reasonable.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        Only charity I give a shit about is me

        • I don’t give a shit about Charity at all, she’s pretty much always been a fancied-up whore.

    • Joseph Curwen

      Yes and no.

      Money is a mean and not an end for itself. Is not about what money is but what you can do with it. In a sense money does buys freedom, but unless you are rich you’ll have to work to get it, so then you are not really free.

      It is important to teach a kid the importance of work and getting money, but teaching him that money is an end by itself is a dead end.

      • Jim Johnson

        I would agree on that, bust your ass early in life, then when you develop the power and status, you can ease back on the throttle and enjoy.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        Yes, money isn’t something that ought to be loved for its intrinsic value of course only for the value of what it can give you. Value of work yes…but also to work smart and not just hard. Loads of guys breaking their backs for pennies have been rationalizing that shit with something like good honest work or strong work ethic when in the end it is just fucking stupidity.

        • Joseph Curwen

          …or not work at all, like me!

          The most difficult decision I made today was: am I going to read Hamlet or spread hate through internet comments first?

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Why not both?

          • Joseph Curwen

            I’m not multitasking….that’s a girl thing.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Well done Curwen

          • Hamlet’s dad is killed by his brother Claude Rains, or some such name, who then marries and all-holes Hamlet’s mother Gertrude.
            Hamlet and his girlfriend wear a lot of black and makeup and whine on and on about not even being able to dry-hump.
            Hamlet acts more like a girl than she does agonizing as he “feels” he doesn’t really like violence or blue balls although he is a bit fond of wetting himself.
            Hamlet’s emo girlfriend Ophelia (who would have been one of those cutter nutters) kills herself and finally Hamlet kills his uncle, but not for murdering his father, no the mama’s boy doesn’t act until his uncle kills his mom. After that, Hamlet dresses up as his dead mother and starts murdering the hotel guests.
            We wake the audience up and go home wondering why we didn’t go see boobies.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Thank you. I am so not a fan of Shakespeare, on so many levels. He was the first soap opera writer and nothing more. His “insights into the human condition” were already noted by many, many great men before him. He did some good real estate investing with his gains and all that, good for him, but I have never been a huge fan of his works.

          • Shakespeare is like the Beatles to me: I like a handful of their pieces, but I wouldn’t call myself a fan by any measure. Hamlet, to my ear, has a certain poetry and rhythm I find pleasing, but Romeo and Juliet always strikes me as garbage.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            That sounds about like where I’m at with him. He was a pop-culture writer in his day. Wee.

            I do like MacBeth, but not enough to go and find it and re-read it. And yes, Romeo and Juliet was utter dreck, the most pure drivel ever to be penned by a human being, ever, in history. If all copies of it were to spontaneously combust and or disappear from the planet, we’d be better off as a species.

          • “Two teenagers get horny and kill themselves. The end.”

            That’s not a romance story! It’s a “keep it in your pants” PSA.

          • bem

            He stole the idea from West Side Story.

          • Musical trivia: Of all his works, Sondheim hates WSS the most. He thinks it’s stupid, basic, and trivial work that should never have been put on stage, much less become a hit.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            And he’s right.

          • bem

            amazing…..I think its fantastic. But again, I’m no musician.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I posit, sir, that the popularization of gangs that dance in unison decades ago is largely responsible for all of the gays we are surrounded by in 2017.

          • Would it be alright to email you a spoof I did in college of Romeo and Juliet? I’d like your thoughts on it.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Sure, shoot me an email.

          • Thanks, found the file and sent it. Enjoy.

          • Joseph Curwen

            rofl!!!

    • John Galt

      Money is a tool. Just like a screwdriver, a gun, a car or a laptop. Money isn’t evil in itself, but a persons love of money over all else. However everyone should try and acquire enough “fuck you money” to at least be able to have options.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        And the love of options above all else is a wonderful thing.

        • Abundance mentality, it’s not just for “plates”…

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I might learn to crochet just to crochet this on a pillow.

    • Consolation_of_Philosophy

      “To a kid lookin’ up to me,
      Life ain’t nothing’ but bitches and money.”

      https://youtu.be/gB_NhBcnsr8

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        Very Nietzschean…Christianity creates mediocrity; It shackles great men to the mundane and average.

        Morals and ethics are handcuffs we willingly put on. Wanna teach a kid something useful, teach them to ignore that bullshit, learn to work the angles and make the world work for him.

        • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

          Some level of shared morality is necessary for society to function. Like “Hey, killing each other for fun is bad” and “Theft from your neighbor is not good”. Without those kind of base level morals and values, society falls apart really quickly. All the money in the world won’t mean squat if you live in a place where killing other people for sport is sanctioned.

          Now a greater level of “morality” and idealism as people tend to get stuck in, sure, agree with you. Most complex moralities and ideologies are little more than people self flagellating via ethics.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Absolutely. Adherence to a social contract is important. However, it is for self-gain. It is only because I want to live in a world where that stuff isn’t going on, because I want society not to fall apart, because I don’t want to live in what Hobbes calls the state of nature that I hold up my end of the social contract. Everything is absolutely about self interest which goes along with greed. Has absolutely zippo to deal with morality it has to deal with living in and participating in the kind of society that makes it possible for you to achieve the most for yourself.

            That there is some kind of great good outside of self interest in just ridiculous.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I’m never one to argue against the primacy of self-interest. Laissez Faire capitalism works only because it hues closest to human nature in regard to self interest. Every other system fails by the degree that it diverges from human nature. By the time you get to socialism you’re so far removed from the human experience that any outside observer would consider it a joke to even suggest it as feasible.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            yup. no disagreement. The social contract benefits everyone….even the people who seek to manipulate it for personal gain need to uphold it just enough to propagate it. But I think that for children to understand this early on rather than pretending it is some kind of absolute moral imperative would be helpful in the same way that children knowing to be suspicious of other people motives at all times is a lesson better learned young.

          • I am inclined to say that there are moral imperatives (or, at least, universally preferable behaviors) that are essential for the formation of “morality contracts,” but mankind is not necessarily inclined to adhere to them.

            Every moral system imposes limits on natural human tendencies. The trick is to impose a moral contract that restricts the most destructive and/or aberrant tendencies while leaving the remainder to individual decisions.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            This is the essence of how I raised my children.

            1. Those are your toys/possessions, you do not have to “share” with anybody nor will you be forced to, if you wish to do so that is entirely your decision. (this was huge and shocked a lot of people I know in real life…fuck forced sharing though)

            2. Actions matter, words are meaningless when it comes to interacting with other people.

            3. If you wish to be treated decently then you have to treat other people with a level of respect in the sense of you can’t go around beating up people for fun or stealing from them.

            4. Life is what you make it, and you and only you are responsible for the outcomes of your decisions. Somebody else fucks with you, learn how to deal with it and move on.

          • As a corollary to number 1, I was taught that almost everything I “owned” as a kid belonged to my father or mother. I didn’t get to make the decision who got to play with what, because that was their choice and they always had final say. Granted, some toys were mine and I got to decide if I shared them, but the rest were theirs.

            I resented that somewhat as a kid, but mostly because it made sense and I was selfish.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I definitely held the “I own this house” rule over them without question. But their toys/gifts/possessions were theirs, and special leniency was given if they actually bought the “thing” with their own money. They couldn’t misuse their things (see “It’s my house!” rule aforementioned) to harm others or property, but I refused, absolutely refused, to mandate sharing. To me that’s one of the biggest gateways to Leftism, and I’ll have none of it. Forced sharing is really the seed people plant that turns into totalitarian mindsets later in life.

          • That’s the ticket. As I mentioned, there were “my” things and there were “my father’s” things. If my sisters messed with my things, it was a violation against me, but if they played with the things my father owned it was all up to him.

            He used to read “The Little Red Hen” to me all the time as a lad. This taught me a valuable lesson about ownership, enterprise, and the greed of the lazy that I have never forgotten. But he also followed it sometimes with an epilogue where the hen chooses to give some of her bread to one or another of the unhelpful animals, not because they earned it but because she wanted to give it to them. In this he explained charity, and I think such teachings are beyond value.

          • John Galt

            “I definitely held the “I own this house…”

          • NemesisEnforcer

            Incidentally, this is closely related to one of my typical counters to smug atheists who are down on the value of religion – there is no inherent greater good in the laws of nature. Morality derives from God. You are correct that on an individual level, the drive of self interest can make people behave in a moral way, but your individual self interest does not compel others to do a thing. Why should anyone assume others will operate with the same self interest as them when all self interests are somewhat different? Even for non-believers, that ‘s what religion brings to the table. As a collective, God functions to provide the structure for moral self interest to function. It’s the same concept as herd immunity with vaccinations. Once enough people believe there is a basis for moral self interest – that we are all generally playing by the same rules – and choose to willingly adhere to it, you can tolerate a few who chose to reject the overarching framework because, by and large, the system will still function.

          • I believe the same thing, but I usually speak in terms of philosophy to the religiously disinclined. I will point to philosophical conceptions of Ideals and universally preferable behavior as a possible standard for morality, then argue that a society must use such standards to forge moral contracts in order to determine good and evil (or right and wrong).

            In the absence of such a basis, we live under the law of the jungle. The whims of the strong are enforced over the weak, and favoritism replaces justice. It is on this basis that our legal system has established such a self-contradictory and indescribably dense legal code, for there is no shared standard by which to judge actions and laws.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I agree and have always found great value in religion for this (and other reasons). Not to put too fine a point on it, but religion brings society to the table. Not everyone was made to transcend its bonds either. One of the huge problems in the last few generations is telling kids that they can do and be anything. Wrong, sometimes your kids are fucking morons and you are poor and the best they can achieve is slightly better than you. That’s ok. That is what much of the greatness in the country is based on. Immigrants who were forward thinking 3 generations ahead and raised their kids to do the same. If each generation takes one more step then you have something. That all fell apart when idealism was built into it. Your comment is perfect. I like to use Jackson Pollack as an analogy for the same thing. You can’t just toss paint and glass and hair and whatever on a big canvas and have it be amazing. You have to have a greater understanding of the whole, the ability and genius to transcend it and the courage to put that into action. Pollack is special — he isn’t just tossing paint on a canvas.

            One book that does this well is Doctor Faustus by Thomas Mann. Modern Atonal Music, 12 tone row stuff isn’t just noise….but it requires a a vast understanding of the field, an immense amount of talent, a touch of genius, a touch of madness and a lot of courage.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Or more simply put, in order to effectively break the rule, you first have to know the rule.

          • I see this in music a lot. Some people break the rules all willy-nilly and produce absolute garbage, and others produce garbage by breaking none of the rules (the first is common among young musicians, the latter among modern industrial music).

            Knowing exactly when and how to break basic rules is the key to producing unique individuality in your music. That unexpected diminished chord or that measure of dissonance can be beautiful in the right place, but in the wrong place it is painful to the ear.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Yep. Had Picasso not been an amazing *classical* artist, his cubism wouldn’t have meant squat. It was that he demonstrated that he could adhere to the rules with supreme perfection which made his breaking the rules so significant and important.

          • bem

            He was still a Phony.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Be that as it may, his influence spread because of what I mentioned. Joe Average in Podunk Missouri doing that at the time would have been met with “Son, you really need to learn to draw”.

          • bem

            Absolutely. He succeed because he was part of a fashionable cult of like-minded poseurs and narcissists. Fashion, not quality.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Eh, I’m not on board with that entirely, although there’s no denying the cult of personality thing plays a major part in defining any kind of art (and always has). I’m not a big fan of his works and it certainly isn’t my taste, but what he did was unique for the time.

          • Many have tried to imitate Picasso without that classical art mastery, and every one of those images is a disaster. If you look at his work, you’ll see certain classic elements of shape and color are adhered to rigidly in every work, simply because without them his work would be abhorrent.

            His works are like spinning plates – a carefully controlled chaos or a chaotic order. Without the order to bind the chaos in place, all you have is madness.

          • bem

            These abuses are rife throughout all creative endeavors. The vast majority of art, music and design is insolent, rebellious crap springing from a combination of vanity and ignorance of the art or craft in question.
            And the minority that isn’t? One needs to be highly attuned and/or educated to recognize and appreciate it.

          • I have spent most of my life performing choral classics, and so even in the absence of instruction I have been sufficiently inundated to identify such things. At the moment, in fact, I’m working on Mendelssohn’s Elijah oratorio, and I am always struck by those moments of dissonance where parts overlap and/or overrun each other. Rather than sounding wrong, they create an aural image of what is being described (a chaotic running of waters, or a wildfire, or an angry mob).

            It requires great mastery to use “bad” elements in the creation of greater art.

          • NemesisEnforcer

            “Wrong, sometimes your kids are fucking morons and you are poor and the best they can achieve is slightly better than you. That’s OK.”

            You are often one to argue to each his own – you like and accept your life, and have no problems with others with different lives doing them same. I believe similarly, and on this point, I think you have touched something important. I see a big disconnect in our society on the assumed worth of people based solely on the money they make or the credentials they hold. There is nothing shameful in being a laborer or a janitor if that is what you are best suited to be, and I don’t categorically look down on these people (I will treat assholes like assholes on an individual basis). I am grateful for people who do those jobs so I don’t have to, and many of them are content where they are.

            By contrast, look at these folks who “make it.” Many of them are not actually very smart, or wealthy, or pleasant, or accomplished, or happy, and many are completely morally compromised hypocrites.

            Fuck, I know plenty of people with far less material wealth than me, but with a far better quality of life! People should always strive to be their best, but sometimes you aren’t going to be a football player brain surgeon astronaut. It’s not only that we fill kids with unrealistic expectations. It’s that we disparage the choices that should be realistic for them. Instead of measuring how miserable life is against the unrealistic expectations, measure how good life is against realistic ones.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I have to agree…but I think a lot of the smart people that don’t “make it” don’t do so because they never learned from a young age that “making it” is actually important. We all, every one of us, grew up with some form of “money is not the be all and end all” and ya know what….a little less of that might not have been the worst thing. As for expectation measurements, I couldn’t agree with you more.

          • “Money can’t buy me love!”

            Yeah, but it can put you in a good house, keep your family well-fed, and keep tires on your car.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Like Barrett Strong Says:

            The best things in life are free
            But you can give them to the birds and bees
            I want money
            That’s what I want
            That’s what I want
            That’s what I want

            Your love is such a thrill
            But your love won’t pay my bills
            I want money
            That’s what I want
            That’s what I want
            That’s what I want

            Money don’t get everything it’s true
            What it don’t get, I can’t use
            I want money
            That’s what I want
            That’s what I want
            That’s what I want

            I want money
            I want lots of money
            In fact, I want so much money
            Give me your money
            Just give me money

          • bem
          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            saw them at Great Adventure in ’89

          • bem

            no WAY!!!!!
            That’s awesome! My one and only ‘big concert’ was in ’89 as well – The Stones and Living Colour at Shea.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            nah, didnt that happen in the movie? puppet show and them?
            did see em in 01 or 02 in manhattan though…

          • bem

            o…..right. didnt catch that.

          • I always liked:

            Not really sure how I was such an 80s kid

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Ha. I remember this song. It was a good one!

          • bem

            Somewhat of an anthem in my high school years….

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Since romantic love is mostly a myth anyway, not being able to “buy love” is irrelevant. Anybody who says that a rich man can’t get a top shelf broad is lying to himself. I’m not one of those “you only need money and looks” types, but there’s no denying that money makes life, and getting chicks, pretty damned easy. Game works too, naturally, but money sure doesn’t hurt.

          • bem

            “get a top shelf broad”
            and you say romantic love is a myth…..

          • Not if she has big enough boobies it isn’t…

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Which again I’m totally down with. When my son wanted to own a gun I put him on the right path. Ok son, what are you going to do to earn the money to buy what you want? I’ll buy it for you in a legal sense (because 13 year olds can’t buy guns legally) but you are paying the cash. Now plan on what you’re going to do to earn those 400 bucks and then do it. He did. Same with daughter. You want that really nice make up? Great! How many hours will you need to put in at work to earn it? Since they grew up with this kind of thing from day one they were never put out or indignant about it, they’d just figure out how to earn the money to buy their toys. To this day both have an iron clad work ethic and strong planning abilities to achieve the goals that they set.

            I raised my kids Intentionally instead of just winging it, had a very clear idea before either was born on how I wanted their upbringing to proceed.

          • NemesisEnforcer

            Of course. But it’s like you said in another comment, people should spend less time focusing on what they want to be and more on how they want to live. There are lots of ways to “make it.” A plumber may have to get his hands dirty in shit occasionally, but if he’s living life on his own terms as he desires, he’s beating the living shit out of the average grievance study credentialed barista with crushing student loans, zero job prospects, and “skills” that are actually less than worthless – they are actively repellent and off-putting to potential employers. She may sneer down her nose at his ignorance as she serves him coffee, but he’s laughing his way to a happy ending while she’s wasting away to cathood.

          • Who takes on the student loan debt when these wastes of carbon die, particularly if they don’t have parents any more?

            In a few decades, we’ll start having to debate whether your Social Security checks will be garnished to cover your loan debt. It sounds ridiculous, but I’ve seen 30-year-olds at university who just never left, working on their umpteenth degree.

          • John Galt

            Today about 175,000 boomers who have the SS garnished to cover their student loans. That number is going to sky rocket each year.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            oh absolutely. Even on a smaller level: I have known I wanted to be in a suit and tie my entire life. Others may have wanted to drive tractors, fly airplanes, be in a uniform, be on a boat or be locked up in a room reading books. If I had made a conscientious effort to follow my dreams for how I wanted to live before I turned 30 my life would be demonstrably better than it is now…and it is pretty good at this point. A lot of parents want their kids to live the way they wish they had….a big mistake. But reverse engineering is the key here. I wanted to live in a penthouse apartment and wear suits every day and live a upscale urban lifestyle and I became a fucking professor. I swear I don’t even remember why. I said “this is the path I will take and try to get the life I want” rather than say “this is the life I want…which path leads to it”

          • I want to own a small tech business where I can do most of my work from home. That’s the life I want, and I’m still making an effort to make that life a reality, but I still don’t know exactly what path leads to it. For now, my path is to absorb as much knowledge as I can about the field and its key players so that I can discern a niche to fill and be prepared to seize it.

            I agree with you 100%. If you don’t know where you want to go, you’ll never find the path toward it. If you never find the path, you’ll never get where you want to go.

          • NemesisEnforcer

            To loop it back to what this article is supposed to be about – I always ask my kids “what do you like to do?” instead of “what do you want to be?”.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            If you ask at 12 and if the kids are honest there will be quite a lot of porn stars and not very many accountants

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            As I recall from my own hinterland years, “A Playboy Photographer” was near the top of my list. For some reason at the time I thought it was some impossible feat to accomplish. This was when Playboy was still relevant and porno movies hadn’t been mainstreamed of course.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Yup. I think I had the standard “MLB Shortstop”

          • bem

            See I’d never want to do that. Ever.

          • I never wanted to go pro in any sport, with the possible exception of teaching martial arts (because I think the exercise and philosophy has value). Never wanted to be a pro musician or lawyer, either, because my grandparents were one of each and I didn’t want their lives.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            You never wanted to be a baseball player? Shit, that is right up there with a dislike of tomatoes in terms of commie tells.

          • bem

            Couldn’t stand baseball….I lacked the attention span. Did OK in KidFootball for a bit, but ditched it in HS to have more time to waste watching TV and wishing I played football.
            Always been cool with ‘maters.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Generations of brave service men died on the field of battle to give you the opportunity to play baseball and you squandered it away! All of their lives, wasted, because you “lacked the attention span”! Countless fields strewn with the dead, all who sacrificed so that you didn’t have to, and you spit in their face. Remember those people who jumped from the buildings during 9/11? They did it so that YOU could have that chance, that one brief chance, to play baseball, and here you are, pissing on their graves. WHY DO YOU HATE AMERICA BEM?!? WHY??!?

          • Well at least he isn’t burning the flag, dressing up his Elvis doll in drag (again), or humping an apple pie in the kitchen for his dad to catch him (it was egg custard).

          • bem

            no comment.

          • That’ll learn ya to mess around another man’s pie, and no taking the cake either…

          • bem

            At least I wasn’t playing SOCCER!!!!!!

          • I think I read recently that soccer is quickly becoming the most popular sport in LA.

            Insert illegal immigration rant here.

          • bem

            Honestly I think its perhpas the best youth sport available.

          • I quit when the competition was all Mexican kids with murder in their eyes (no exaggeration – they spoke almost no English and weren’t above “accidentally” kicking you if you tripped). Before that, it was good exercise and rather enjoyable.

            I prefer martial arts, though. I’m plannin’ to learn my youngin’s rasslin’ when they’re small, partly to keep ’em from bitin’ each other and partly because it’s a good sport that can help you out in a pinch.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            False. The best youth sport available is Lacrosse. Fact.

          • bem

            hmmmm. nah – parents have to buy too much shit.

          • In that vein, I’ll add “basketball.” To play soccer semi-safely, you need shin guards, but if you have access to a court you can play basketball.

            Kickball’s good, too, now that I think on it.

          • bem

            Kickball’s headed back towards baseball.

          • But it moves faster, especially when you’re young. That’s all we ever played at recess, and everyone came up to kick several times during that half-hour.

          • bem

            I concede it was fun in school. And those pimply red balls could catch some air if you kicked ’em right!

          • By second grade some of us could clear the school fence every time. In retrospect, that might explain why they built a bigger fence that summer…

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            If you want to play the best youth sport in the world, there is a price of admission that parents should be willing to pay. This is a rich man’s sport after all. Pony up, or get the fuck off the field.

          • bem

            Fuk elitist kids sports! All kids are poor by definition and should be treated accordingly.

          • “Go find a stick and poke something.”

            Actually, come to think of it, we did that a lot as kids.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Yes, we allow you serfs to hold that as true. It amuses us.

            Don’t hate the game, hate the players.

          • bem

            sheeeeee-it you grew up at least as broke as I did!
            But if we’re ignoring the equipment/facilities burden associated with a game, I would offer ice hockey as superior to both.

            But, to keep a rabble of yutes out of trouble, active, and even mildly entertained, soccer is the way to go.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I grew up poor, but my son didn’t. Pound for pound Lacrosse was the most excellent game, ever, and it was fun for adults to watch too. Honorable mention for Hockey, yes, no question. Soccer is only valid if you want your kid to grow up and get a sex change operation.

          • bem

            hahahahaha
            Unsubstantiated prejudice! I once thought as you do though.

          • Playing soccer doesn’t make you gay. Watching it while wearing a jersey for a team no one else has ever heard of while chugging box wine from a McDonald’s cup makes you gay.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            side note, thanks to the magic of the iPhone now everyone can be a playboy photographer.

          • bem

            I wanted to be a pimp from the second I learned what one was.

          • Access to broads: check
            Money for nothing: check
            Sweet threads: check

            Where do I sign?

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            That’s why they call you Huggy Bear!

          • bem

            I thought it was because I wrecked their garbage cans….

          • NemesisEnforcer

            Same result if you ask adults at 40.

          • As a kid, I wanted to be a chemist. Turns out, I’m shit at chemistry and I hate it.

            What I like to do is make things that work and play with computers. If I’d focused on that when I was a kid, I’d be a better programmer and be more successful today.

          • bem

            You mentioned ‘The right path’ before….This starts to open
            up a subject I struggle with. During a young person’s development, is it better to encourage them to cultivate their tendencies or their interests?

            For example a kid displays a certain knack for math, that is, he never seems to have to study it as hard as other subjects.
            But every time you turn around he’s reading books about history. He never tires of it, yet somehow fails to excel in in the subject. Which one should he pursue?

          • History will always be a hobby for such a kid. Encourage it, but don’t expect history to pay his bills.

            Take me, for example. I loved and love playing video games, but after all these years I’m still not good at it. I hated (and still kind of hate) writing, but I’m actually pretty good at it. I’ll never be a professional gamer, but I’ve managed to make a few bucks on the side by writing (and my work-related documentation was always appreciated for its clarity – that doesn’t hurt).

          • bem

            Similar here. Tendencies were always towards the verbal and I was always being nudged into ‘English’ and ‘creative writing’ and other vocational dead-ends. But, my interests were always in more technical things despite having no inherent aptitude for them. And, through shoehorning myself into a more technical career I often wonder if I should have trusted my strengths instead.

          • There are hundreds of thousands of English majors out there, and maybe a few hundred are writers of any prominence (and that may well be generous). A degree in English is only useful for teaching and becoming an editor with the big publishing houses (and they’re dying fast).

            Larry Correia is one of Baen’s best selling authors, and he’s a professional accountant and gun store owner. Isaac Asimov was a biochemist. If they can be renowned writers, surely anyone with an idea can.

            The path of the English major is one of failure, and it starts long before the degree. If they’re lucky, they work for below-minimum wage for a rag like Buzzfeed. You made the right call.

          • bem

            True enough. The craft of writing, like any, is honed through practice not education.

          • My mom really, really wanted me to go get an English degree from an overpriced fancy school (because, again, I’m not half bad at writing, no matter how lazy my comments are). I did my homework and told her to shove it – good writers can come from anywhere, and without at least a Master’s degree it doesn’t qualify me to do anything other than bitch about the lack of jobs.

          • bem

            Very similar experience here too.

          • John Galt

            “The path of the English major is one of failure, and it starts long before the degree.”
            That is so true. A former friend of mine pursued that degree after HS. He was pissed when he was rejected for the masters program (which I told he would be as a straight white male) and he really enjoyed being a student– no ambition what comes after university. I’ve heard through mutual acquiantances that he is currently, between lengthy periods of unemployment and 2 divorces, eeks out a living reviewing tech manuals. He is almost 50 and doesn’t have a pot to piss in.

          • Murdoc34

            Which one should he pursue?

            Plumbing.

          • bem
          • bem

            Took that up extra-curricularly.

          • How long do you think I could run an after-school handiman camp before I was busted over child labor regulations?

            Imagine it: the kids get valuable life skills and can become part of improving their own communities while I get paid by the parents for babysitting and local businesses and homeowners for the work they do.

          • Murdoc34

            How long do you think I could run an after-school handiman camp before I was busted over child labor regulations?

            Ten, maybe eleven minutes?

          • If I were to do it, I’d probably call it some sort of after-school education camp. I’d like to be able to give them some money as a reward for doing a good job (incentives are everything), but I am 99.9% sure that’d guarantee me lawsuits.

          • bem

            Then they can branch out into pickpocket-ting, etc. Eh, Fagan?

          • They have their food. Glorious food!

          • bem

            what do you want to do
            what do you want to have
            how do you want to live

            “what do you want to be” is foolish.

          • Boothe

            I definitely grew up with the “money isn’t everything / money can’t buy you happiness” mindset. And that is true. But the flip side of that is not having enough money can damned sure make you miserable! I was fortunate in that my dad gave up what could have been a very lucrative business to persue academic interests that didn’t pay squat. I was able to experience being poor, which gave me the impetus to pursue a lucrative career. Hardship is good for children in this respect. If I had everything handed to me, I would probably feel just as entitled as many folks I have encountered these days and been every bit as successful. Instead, I understood that I had figure out what I could do to make a good living, then get off my ass and go do it!

          • Most of the kids I meet think being a janitor or a machinist is somehow beneath them. These same kids either have worthless degrees or, if they’re not idiots, have just been stuck in retail or food services since they were teens.

            The richest guys I personally know are a plumber and an electrician, respectively. They have Jim-sized families and acres of ranch land, but they’re still financially better-off than unattached millennials in tiny apartments who think such jobs are beneath them.

          • NemesisEnforcer

            Unless my kids want to enter a filed like medicine, law or engineering, where higher education is required, I would advise them instead to pursue a trade. Far better job prospects, and decent money. Plus its transportable, so you are not tied to a specific area and can pick up and go wherever the jobs are.

          • I’m still kicking myself for chaining myself to a lease while unemployed. There were programming jobs everywhere but where I live, and I just couldn’t bring myself to slap down the (frankly obscene) early-exit fee, load up a truck, and move.

          • John Galt

            Go STEM or go home. Nothing wrong with being a tradesmen, nurse, accountant or technician.

          • dckhead_con_artist

            We have to tow the fine line between being a thief and a philanthropist

          • A boy should learn to seek the “why” of things. Some of what we call “ethics” is simply that which is required to build and maintain a functioning, just, and free society (e.g. “Do not steal” and “Do not bear false testimony”). Proof by contradiction is simple enough for many of these principles.

            What is left, however, may not even actually be ethical. Vegans go on about the ethics of their lifestyle compared to others, but if you look into “why” you’ll see they’re monopolizing large amounts of land to meet their nutritional requirements and unwittingly benefiting from the wholesale slaughter of small animals every year.

        • Consolation_of_Philosophy

          Here’s a sentiment that would get me banned at RoK: I love that album, and it is packed with philosophically rich commentary.

    • cheeseburgercheeseburger

      make money these days? grow weed. heard about an a shady dude from here move out to nevada…makes $25k, NET, every two months..pays no taxes of course…developments like this make me question my sanity…

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        Finance and Economics dual Major, Math Minor, JD/MBA program all from IVY schools. Welcome to netting 100k a month.

        • dckhead_con_artist

          I got a mail order MBA from the back of Mad Magazine

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            wotmeworry?!?!?

        • bem

          Tips for wealth:
          Have college and/or wedding paid for by someone else
          Be born Jewish
          Be born in 1930

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I’d amend that a bit. Be born Jewish and in 1930, but do NOT be born in Germany if the other two conditions are met.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            wish I could source the chart, but people born in the early 40s were the top wage earners…steadily declining ever since

          • bem

            I heard 30s!
            They walked into the most robust eceonomy the world had ever seen, right at about 25 yeras old…

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            early 40s was the top, chart showed a rise every yr from whenever it started, late 20s/early 30s, dont remember…it went up yr after yr for the first 10 plus yrs it tracked, peaked in the early 40s…

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I tend to ignore charts like that, they provide nothing but excuses for being a failure. I make a ton of bread right now and don’t think I ever would have been able to had I been born in, say, 1925. My skillset is cut out for the modern world and I’m profiting by it a lot. Using a general “wager earner” chart ignores a lot of factors that change with time I think. It can be generally useful to an extent but I do think that many people use it as an excuse to whine and give up while feeling self satisfied about their own failures.

          • dckhead_con_artist

            my biggest financial victory in life was filing for chapter 7 after my business failed. While in Chapter 7 I had over $50K in home renovations completed that were completely discharged. For the next 2 years after I declared chapter 7 I got over $40K back in taxes per year. my initial business investment was only $60K and a lot of those assets I kept. Less than 2 years after the state bankruptcy I started another business .

          • bem

            See I don’t like that….
            Though, its not you’re fault that the law allows for these kinds of abuses. You’d be a fool not to take advantage.

          • dckhead_con_artist

            I used to think like that as well. Long before a divorce and a business failure, I paid off all my balances on my credit cards on every month, I believed in loving your wife and supporting her, I believed that every person is good, my franchisor had my best interests in mind, that my wife (ex) loved me. I also believed that my corporate employer was doing me a favor by hiring me.

          • bem

            You’d been mentally molested.

          • dckhead_con_artist

            without a reach around…

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            you left out:
            be born a Mayflower WASP and swipe a sports almanac from a time traveler who has Parkinson’s.

          • bem

            Of course. How careless of me.

  • dckhead_con_artist

    The less you know…

    • Consolation_of_Philosophy

      Alright, that is disturbing…

    • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

      that mustache tho

  • dckhead_con_artist
    • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

      This sounds like a pretty interesting concept.

      “Yeah Becky, so I tied you up and fucked you in the ass, but I’m willing to clean out your gutters and edge your lawn so we’re even, right?”

      • Somehow, that all reads like you just repeated the first part twice, just dirtier…something like “once more with euphemisms.”

      • bem

        I mean…..lets reserve judgement until we see what state the house/grounds are in….

      • NemesisEnforcer

        Well, Harvey Weinstein has proven that post hoc gratuities can convince women to keep quiet about rape, etc… for years, so maybe this dude is just trying to copy Harvey’s demonstrated successful business model.

        • Of course this makes headlines despite it being an “open secret” in Hollywood for decades largely because it was women while Bryan Singer and others are left alone. Makes me wonder who Harvey crossed/what he might have refused to go along with.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            The very first thing that came to my mind about him. He crossed somebody, this kind of thing doesn’t get leaked on accident.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            First thing I thought too.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            I was told the previous superman star(not cavill) had put out for singer in order to get cast…its a dark, dark place

          • Brandon Routh. Hadn’t heard that, but interesting that he appeared in that Kevin Smith film (Zack & Miri Make a Porno) as a homo after Superman Returns.

        • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

          Harvey Weinstein proved that wealthy and powerful Hollywood moguls take advantage of attractive young women and then make them stars. On a side note, it rained yesterday and that proved that walking in the rain makes people wet.

          • dckhead_con_artist

            what is he like 65? now he will retire and all of this will blow over. NBD. sex for resources, the oldest game.

          • bem

            Such a joke….I mean, the ‘casting couch’ has existed as long as there’s been casting. And couches!

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Until the allegations of rape surfaced, my response about him has been “So what?” Big deal, he lured women to his room and tried to get his perv on, but it was all consensual and nobody was forcing the women to hang out. Hell, they *knew* why they were asked there before they stepped one foot inside his door, they understand the game all too well.

            Now if he actually raped some chicks (3 allegations so far) that’s another matter entirely, but as with Cosby, I need to ask “Did they file police reports at the time and further what proof outside of allegations can they offer”. My guess is “no” and “zero”.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Yeah, and the “luring” part is iffy. Jack Warner was doing this in the early 1900’s. Anyone who doesn’t think that Rita Hayworth sucked some cock to get on screen is naïve. As for rape charges: I am filing that in the same circular file that I put all rape charges that are made public years and even decades after they happen…….Did Weinstein rape anyone? By today’s definition of rape…sure I bet he did. But by any sane definition? NFW. You see Wienstein holding down some broad, ripping her clothes off and sticking it in her? Never. Hey honey I will give you a shot to be a star to every small town American girl who came to Hollywood with dreams of being on the silver screen and naivety in her eyes? Absolutely. Booze and drugs at Hollywood parties where star struck girls wound up taking a bunch of dick? yup? Let me know when someone has a video tape of him beating the shit out of a woman and dragging her body behind an alley while she screams no and I will reconsider.

      • dckhead_con_artist

        bartering , soon to replace quantitative easing and the fiat system.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        That’s prob what the Gatlin boys planned on doing after they got done with a drink or two and becky got out of her rape shower.

    • bem

      From the “My Bad….” files….

    • John Galt

      She paid $5 after he raked the yard?? Must have been some bad sex.

  • dckhead_con_artist

    Some New York City wisdom…

    • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

      lol….computer guy seems not to get it wrt women.

      • dckhead_con_artist

        Bass Player / Dog Walker … should be the last guy to get all mushy about older women..the 17 year old has got it down…

  • A lot of good suggestions. I’d like to add one:

    A strong sense of integrity. Too often we see people nowadays saying one thing and doing the opposite behind closed doors. Look no further than Hollywood to see this in action. Some might scoff and say “it’s just Hollywood.” but like it or not, these people are a big influence on the citizens if nothing more than the fact that they’re plastered everywhere; tv, social media, etc. we can limit our exposure to it, but completely escaping it is very difficult. Best to raise your sons with a sense of integrity and then you don’t have to worry about other’s hypocrisy.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        according to the laws of rap battles I believe he is new POTUS.

      • John Galt

        Marshal was always a whiny bitch. Never understood his fandom.

        • bem

          Novelty. “oo look – a white rapper!”
          Think Tiger Woods

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I dunno, he was proceeded by IceT and Kid Rock wasn’t he?

            Kid Rock being one of my favorite musicians to listen to while cruising on my motorcycle. Eminem is and always has been a little bitch, could never stomach his drivel.

          • bem

            Ice T is black and Kid Rock is…..well, different. He has a very unique style that transcends rap.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Right, fuck, I meant Vanilla Ice, my bad.

          • bem

            ohhhhhhhhh. of course. Yes, that fool was pure novelty.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Yeah, KR expanded and grew. But back in the day he was basically rap rap rap and maybe one slow song thrown in for God Know Why.

          • Boothe

            I think you meant Vanilla Ice not IceT.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            I’ve already been corrected! Bitch!

            Heh.

          • Boothe

            Yeah didn’t read far enough ahead. Life’s a bitch sometimes!

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I like his music..especially in the gym.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Tiger Woods has released an album?

        • cheeseburgercheeseburger

          his “Lose Yourself” is one of sociopaths’ favorite songs…rap is their fave genre
          he became famous by slamming his mom and GF…always thought that was lame

  • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

    A very good lesson for children is to make sure you have a 9 figure trust fund. Remember, sometimes all you really need in life is 500 million dollars.

    • bem

      Indeed. If I had it all to do over again, I’d have been born into wealth.

      • cheeseburgercheeseburger

        pre pre pre planning is key

        • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

          Now THAT is pre-natal care.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            in utero wealth management

          • bem

            YES!!!!
            THAT is the new frontier of financial services!!

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Goldman Amniotic Sacs

            (Sorry, but I think I just won the internet today)

          • bem

            EXCELLENT.

        • Ironically, I have something like that on a much smaller scale. My great-grandparents were big into bonds for their children and grandchildren, and they even bought some for their hoped-for great-grandchildren. These bonds were reinvested into mutual funds for us at some point or another, and so I apparently have much more money hidden away somewhere than I see on my bank statement.

          Not that I let myself touch it. However much is there, if I took it I’d be tempted to spend it. Then, if I needed it, I’d be SOL.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            you got enraged right? if so-congrats

          • I assume you meant “engaged,” but “enraged” is often enough accurate. Weddings are bullshit.

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

        It’s really the way to go

        • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

          “Have you ever been on a yacht?
          “No, is it wonderful?”
          “It doesn’t suck”

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I heard someone put it like this: Have you ever seen anyone frowning on a jetski?

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Another fun quote from a movie I’ve seen years ago is “Never feel sorry for a man who owns an airplane”. Heh.

          • What if his airplane crashes with him in it?

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            depends. Are the big bopper and buddy holly with him? If so, they will say Oooh My Head

          • bem

            Or on a spiritual note, he’ll become a Free Bird.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            But the point is that Don Henly would write a 6 hour song about it.

          • bem

            “but if I sell out, what will they say about me after I’m gone?”

            ” ‘He owned a plane.’ “

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            one of my cousin’s said it best: I’ve been trying to sell out my whole life.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Years ago I did work with a big CM who was just fucking great. I can’t even physically describe him because he is so recognizable but he had the real heavy Brooklyn accent and zero filter. He did such a good job at things that he could get away with murder. It was just wonderful working with him. Anyway, we are sitting in a construction meeting with the developer who was a real cranky miserable guy and my partner I was working with yells with that amazing Brooklyn ginzo voice “AYYYYYY SOANDSO, SMILE A-LITTLE….YOUR THE RICHEST MAN I EVA FELT BAD FAAAA”

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)
          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            The only men I truly pity are those who have no say over their own hairstyle and who have to get the wife’s permission before entering a barber shop. Those poor, poor sorry guys. My heart goes out to them.

          • Fucker.

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Yesssss!

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            Overboard reference? Annie Goolahee?

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Arthur

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            one of the most quotable movies.
            My mother died when I was 6
            Oh that’s terrible. Parents never understand what they do to us
            my father raped me when I was 12
            so…you had 6 pretty good years at least.

    • dckhead_con_artist

      ..and Kratom…BOOM ! I said it…I win!

      • *whistles*
        Personal foul!
        Kratom reference being used on a non-sponsored post.
        Penalty being awarded on the play. Demoting winning comment to a regular, run of the mill comment.

        • bem

          BANNED.

        • Murdoc34

          But there are no sponsored posts!

          • dckhead_con_artist

            fvck!

          • bem

            I’ll sponsor YOUR posts!

          • Murdoc34

            Excellent. I think we can reach an equitable agreement for all. I’ll mention you in every comment I make, for the low low fee of $2 per post.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            subcontract it to an Indian(dot, not feather) for 10 cents. make killing. retire at 93

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I’ll post YOUR sponsor!

          • Hmmm you’re right. Tell you what, round up a posse of commenters here and go to all the RP/Manosphere sites you can find and gush about how great AKC is, how engaged the readers are, and how it’s really exploded recently. Then mention that we are accepting sponsored posts that would help them promote their own site.

            1. Promote AKC
            2. Receive sponsored posts
            3. Profit
            4. Kratom jokes galore

            Everyone wins.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            you forgot ?????

          • When Kratom is involved, there are no “?????”

        • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

          whistle? whistle? Jak….did you just 2017 rape…..KRATOM?

  • Boothe

    There is quite a bit of discussion already going on about money, morality and self interest below. So no need to touch on that. But to me, equally if not more important skills involve self defense and survival. A boy should be taught how to fight from a very early age. That doesn’t mean he should be taught TO fight. Quite the contrary, he should be taught to control his temper and avoid a fight whenever possible. But just like carrying a fire extinguisher or wearing a seat belt, it best to have the skills even if the need to use them never arises.

    In that same vain, woodcraft and survival skills should be taught to your children, boys and girls. You may live in an urban or suburban area and believe that these skills are useless, but they serve several purposes. Knowing the basics such as starting a fire, providing shelter, obtaining clean water and finding food are tremendous confidence builders.

    These skills also help program one’s mind to improvise in any situation. Once you have it mentally ingrained that there are multiple uses for any given item and more than just the conventional ways of doing things, you can cross apply that to practically all areas of your life. Of course if your children are ever stranded in the wilderness, they will stand a much greater chance of surviving as well.

    • I overheard a lady talking the other day about visiting some family who lived off grid. One morning her niece whispered something in her mom’s ear. Her mom nodded and off the little girl went. She didn’t come home until that afternoon, but when she did, she was proudly carrying a haul of fish for dinner. She had made her own fishing rod from a stick she found down near the river. Later this same little girl cleaned and prepared the fish for that night’s meal as well.
      I was duly impressed as she was no older than 10.

      • John Galt

        That is awesome.

  • Bart Manson ✓ᵂʰᶦᵗᵉ

    How to change a tire.

    Not because changing a tire is some incredible skill, but because so many people today simply cannot do it and they should be able to.

    • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

      I know a girl who is breathtakingly beautiful. Swimsuit model type beauty. She was talking to me one time and I asked if she ever had to change a tire.

      “No, why would I ever want to do that?”
      “Because your tire went out on the road and you had to?”
      “Why would I have to when I can just flag down somebody to do it for me?”
      “You’re telling me you have no idea how to change a tire??”
      “No, my dad tried to teach me once but I told him that I’ll never have to change a tire myself as long as men are around. Tee hee” (titty wiggle)
      “So you’re counting on somebody being around at three in the a.m. on a deserted country road and thus you don’t need to learn a pretty simple thing like this?”
      “More or less. ”

      So utterly clueless that she’ll one day age and those pretty titties, long legs and fine ass will eventually sag, droop and wither. She lives in *exactly* this moment and there is, in her mind, no such thing as “the future”. I’ll bet dad wanted to knock some sense into her head when she said it too.

      • Bart Manson ✓ᵂʰᶦᵗᵉ

        Did she even have a dad around? I wouldn’t be surprised if the answer was no.

        • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

          Yes, that’s how her dad was there to try and teach her. 🙂

          He was kind of a waste though, real boozer (at least he was when older, I suspect he was when she was growing up too).

      • I’m reminded of one of the first episodes of “Last Man Standing” (one of the few shows out there still worth a damn, even if it was cancelled prematurely). Ditz daughter keeps begging daddy to just fix her oil, but good ole Tim Allen makes her do it before she can drive again.

        It was well-done. Even while she bitches about how it wrecked her nails, she looks proud of her accomplishment.

        • “It was well-done. Even while she bitches about how it wrecked her nails, she looks proud of her accomplishment.”

          This is why its so important to encourage your lady to keep at it until she can deep-throat properly, the look that comes over her face when she finally gets it…

        • Last Man Standing really is a diamond in the rough. I can really related to poor Tim Allen too seeing abs I have three daughters as well, albeit much younger.

          • It’s hard for me to see how the three daughters can be so very different, but it’s heartening to see them all turn out “all right.”

            Liberal teen mom starts seeing things from her father’s point of view when it comes to making life better for her son (and so does hippy douche baby daddy, which is fun). Though unable to go to college and dealing with several years of single motherhood (aided by her parents), she’s doing okay.

            Ditzy Kardashian-in-training is starting to become a better person as well, mostly because she has discovered a trade she enjoys and just won’t give up anymore. This is complemented by her “cuck-slowly-becoming-a-real-boy” boyfriend to produce a better person. She’ll be alright.

            And then there’s my favorite, daddy’s little soldier. No idea what she’ll become when she grows up, but she’s always heeded her father’s advice and it’s all been good.

            Totally different girls, all of them going to be okay mostly because of an excellent father (and mother – I love the mother character).

          • Old Goat

            I don’t watch much tv, especially sitcoms. I heard a lot about this show when it got cancelled so I decided to give it a shot. Now it’s one of my daughter’s favorites. We watch it together & even she makes fun of how different the men & women on the show are portrayed compared to other media.

          • There was some really good political bashing in that show. Both sides got their shots in which is way different than typical shows which portray conservatives as bumbling idiots easily destroyed by the lib’s superior intellect.

      • Jim Johnson

        Although talking about a war situation, Isaiah 3:16-26 almost describes this woman perfectly. A prideful woman gets taken down and there is nothing left for her in the end.

        • Well, we do lose our mighty in our incessant wars, and a lot of feminists have that balding look…

      • dckhead_con_artist

        women are also not big picture thinkers either. My buddy was married to his high school sweetheart. They had dual white collar incomes, vacations, race cars , house paid off, and she posed for dirt car promos as a side business. At some point she caught the feelers or her vag got wet for a “badder boy” at work. She fvcked him for a few months and then turned into a party girl including 3somes. After some time and a lot of weight gain she ended up with a guy who cannot hold down a job, is a cuck, and she’s paying the mortgage. She complains that she hasn’t been on a vacation in 5 years. They were talking over facebook yesterday and she said how she left my buddy for personal freedom…He responded: ” That doesn’t sound like freedom to me” .. She had no answer

        • I like that. “That doesn’t sound like freedom to me.”

          What she was into was the rebellion. She loved the things your buddy could provide materially, but she wanted to be excited and thrilled, which she got by boinking randoms behind his back. Mistaking the thrill for love (another casualty of the “romantic love” bologna), she shacked up with a loser who not only cannot provide the thrill but also cannot provide the material goods she desires.

          She’s trapped in a prison of her own making.

          • dckhead_con_artist

            These things have all been written by better men than us … Tolstoy Anna Karenina being a prime example.

        • bem
    • I’d also add “how to change your oil,” “how to cook basic meals,” and “how to fix basic housing issues” to the list.

      If it didn’t require certification, I’d be a handyman today. People will pay through the nose for the cheapest, simplest fixes imaginable.

      • Bart Manson ✓ᵂʰᶦᵗᵉ

        All good ones. I was going to post another comment on the cooking one.

        As stupid as it is, how to do laundry is rapidly becoming another lost art.

        • I’ve seen it. Sure, kids these days are competent enough to pour some fluid in the machine and hit a button, but I’ve not seen anyone actually fold, put away, or hang their clothes in…I don’t rightly know how long.

          • bem

            I am thoroughly inept at this as well, but I earned that right through marriage!

          • Take my man card now, because I do all the laundry at home. Everything gets folded efficiently and put away right where it belongs every time. No mess, no ugliness, no “where oh where is my favorite shirt”.

          • UWOTM8

            Other guys I’ve known:
            1. Clean basket
            2. Dirty Basket
            3. Sniff Test
            4. ???
            5. Profit

            Me:
            -Flawlessly triple-folding towels and nearly planning a logistical chain around where my clothes are stored.

            Two things may have influenced this though; the military and the realization that modern women sure as hell won’t do it if I can’t.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Exactly the same…I think my natural OCD and love of routine might have played well in the military. A buddy of mine, a jarhead, when he first came over my place, told me he never thought anyone who wasn’t in the mil could or would make their bed the way I do…..

          • There’s a satisfaction to having the sheets just right. That clean look, the feeling of lying down and sort of breaking the bed in, all of it just feels right.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            yes! I can’t leave the house without it. I also change my sheets every 3rd day. When I get home tired from work and the gym and I shower and eat and clean and pack my gym bags for the morning and pack my brief case and lay my clothes out I am tired and getting under the covers on a taught sheet in a well made bed is just a thing of beauty. Totally worth the time in the am

          • I don’t mind throwing getting a load of laundry started and putting what’s in the washer into the dryer but if I try to fold the clothes, I get scolded by my wife…so she folds. Heh.

          • Jim Johnson

            If anything that going on a mission helped me is it taught me how to properly take care of white shirts and tie a tie. Two years is a long time to make those last.

          • How did you prevent pit stains and yellowing?

          • Jim Johnson

            borax, and easy on the bleach…..still it is inevitable

        • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

          Laundry is the one house chore I refuse to do…period. I was, and cook, and clean, scrub my floors, do my dishes, clean my bathroom and my home is immaculate…I have a bit of the ole ocdeeees but I steadfastly refuse to do laundry. I always have. Thankfully I live in a city with half a million Chinese so it isn’t an issue. I will never do my own laundry.

          • Murdoc34

            Strongly suggest washing the Coca-cola T-shirt yourself.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            nice!

          • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

            Why? Laundry is maybe the easiest chore in the world. I get not doing suits because they need dry cleaning but general laundry has to be the most trivial task known to man. You throw the clothes in, you turn a knob, you throw in a cap full of detergent, close the lid and walk away.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Everyone has shit they hate to do. Laundry is mine. It isn’t just the machine. Stuff needs to be properly separated, washed, dried, folded, hung etc. etc. etc. I just refuse. I will sit and scrub pots all day, but I am not cleaning and folding laundry. I go to my app and click for a laundry pick up. Within 30 minutes I get a guy at my door. I get a notification when it is finished. I hit the app and in 30 minutes it is delivered…separated, folded, hung and just needs to be placed in the proper drawers. It is the only household chore I refuse to do.

          • Jim Johnson

            My parents made me do my laundry when I was a kid, I would do just like GOJ says, pick up dirty clothes once a week, throw them in (without separating) and dump them into my big dresser drawers. Not much work, but the whites were dingy and I looked unkempt. I wished my mom taught me better when I was in my youth. Something so basic as separating you would think would be obvious, but not to a dumb kid.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            yup. And I am very particular. Everything needs to be folded nearly right down to my drawers. Nothing is stuffed in my draws. everything is folded by item, by color, etc etc or hanged properly. Most of my work clothes get dry cleaned so that is totally separate. The vast bulk of stuff is just gym clothes, socks and underwear and then bedding etc. But it does take some time if you want everything folded to the point of creases.

          • Jim Johnson

            I agree. Laundry is one of those chores I leave totally up to the wife. My suit, white shirts, button up work shirts and slacks I want the creases in. Not as particular in the other stuff. She hates laundry, but I have things I don’t like to do also.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Yup. I don’t think there is anything objectively wrong with doing laundry, I just really hate doing it and it takes a long time and has to be done right. But as long as, when you have a team, there is a division of labor that plays to strengths no big deal. I enjoy cooking and even enjoy washing dishes. I have a system. I find it therapeutic. Even mopping the floors can be fun. I get super particular in everything mostly because I am a nut bag….but also, keep in mind, I rarely dress casually. I had one pair of jeans. They recently ripped and I don’t think I will even bother buying another. Even on weekends I put on slacks and a shirt and if the weather calls for it a blazer and often will wear a tie to dinner if I go out. In the hot summer I will wear shorts if I am running errands and I have a lot of gym clothes, but 80% of what I wear most people would consider being dressed up

          • Lou Skunt
          • L’UltimoConservatore

            Speaking of laundry…

            Here I am in supposedly feminist saturated Italia, and I’m going on 100% rate of women that know how to do laundry so far. And most of them cook too.

            Really has me wondering about all the Return of Kratom articles about how women have no skills now in Western Europe. Either I’m really lucky or just maybe… those writers have abysmally poor taste in women.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Some people read the internet too much. Women in Italy, France and Germany are generally amazing and know how to be women

    • Murdoc34

      Initially I thought all the other driveway-mechanic-capable maintenance tasks might be good to add to this list, but remembering my own experience suggests there is no need to force the issue. I was so thoroughly uninterested in helping dad work on the car when I was young. It was only when it became of value to me (owned a car, had no budget to pay for repairs) did I bother to figure it all out.

      • GhostOfJefferson ✓ᴺᵃᵗᶦᵒᶰᵃˡᶦˢᵗ

        Necessity is the mother of a’wrenchin’

    • B1k3_Ch41N

      You’ll be surprised how many people fail at menial tasks. Thank god for Youtube showing them the way.
      I read somewhere about a supermarket having to teach classes to their young employees on how to hammer a nail and use a drill bit or even how to mop the floor. Can’t remember if is was in England or US.

      • “How to sweep the goddamn floor,” “How to mow a lawn,” and “How to vacuum the whole floor, not just wavy strips here and there” should be on the list.

        • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

          I had the best sweeping lesson. One of my jobs when I was young was at a tow truck joint. I cleaned the shop, washed the trucks, ran to get coffee and eventually started riding along on the trucks. There was a yard out front of the shop and across the street was a textile factory. One day I had the big push broom and was cleaning the yard like a lazy fool. Across the street was all the Latinas working at the textile place smoking. One of the hot shot chaser truck drivers who would be one of my early mentors WRT womanizing came over and put my top hand in a proper fist on top of the broom and fixed my posture and told me to put my back into it. Then he points across the street to the senoritas and says “those girls over there are watching you and right now they think you fuck like you sweep…like a lazy bastard” To this day I agitate the dirt so hard I think I pull up asphalt

          • It reminds me of some advice passed down to me about buying cars. When I was in the market for a new used car to take up to college (some old lady t-boned me at 20 miles an hour, came within millimeters of crushing me), my dad asked me, “Would you go out in the hot summer sun every Saturday to wash this car?”

            To this day, I go out there with a rag and a bucket to hand-wash my trustworthy SUV, mostly to remind me of the lesson.

      • B1k3_Ch41N
        • The title alone is disgusting. My daddy gave me a board and some nails to play with when I was a wee lad.

          Great toy for little boys. They’ll sit there happily hammering away for hours if you let ’em.

          • B1k3_Ch41N

            Yeah, I used to play with spanners and screwdrivers when I was young trying to fix my bike and such.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            until @disqus_tj7gjZttfg:disqus came along and stole that shit

          • bem

            really throws a wrench in the works…

          • UnreconstructedConfederate

            You people and your “spanners”.

        • Murdoc34

          Recently had to show one how to change a 9V battery.

          It’s kind of clichéd to proclaim ‘there’s something wrong with all you kids today’, but, I don’t know, some of these millennials seem really really special. Measuring tapes? 9V batteries?

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            measuring tape is one thing, but to be fair I don’t think I have seen a 9V battery in years, maybe over a decade. Some things do just get phased out of usefulness.

          • Still used in pretty much all smoke detectors and stud finders. Outside of that, you have to go back a few decades to find devices that use them.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Ha. For the last 20+ years the first thing I have done when moving into an apartment has been to disconnect fire alarm. Last time I used a stud finder was in the last place when I hung my TV on the wall and it was a rechargeable. I’m fairly certain the only thing that anyone needs a 9V for is to put on their tongue

          • Braces. That was always an experience.

          • Murdoc34

            the guy that professionally is, at least in part, concerned with code compliance disconnects his fire alarm. that’s awesome.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            lol…indeed.

          • Lou Skunt

            That sounds like me. I even detach my doorbells – I can’t stand the sound of a doorbell – it’s too disruptive. I remove the doorbell button entirely, and over where it was located, I install a cute little custom bronze plaque that says: “please ring bell, do not knock”… watching the reactions of solicitors is priceless!

        • Bart Manson ✓ᵂʰᶦᵗᵉ

          That is so sad in so many ways.

    • cheeseburgercheeseburger

      the CEO of AAA wishes you would take a long walk off a short pier

    • manuel hernandez

      There was this Liberty Mutual ad that features this woman who’s grateful because the insurance company sent someone to bail her son out because of a blowout. Meanwhile, there’s these two kids stuck roadside at night because they don’t know how to change a tire and their insurance company doesn’t cover roadside assistance. Truly absurd. Meanwhile, a couple of weeks ago I had a blowout driving to work. As soon as I found a parking lot, I changed that sucker and put on the spare tire in less than 10 minutes. It actually took me longer to get a replacement tire because there are no tire shops open at 7am.

  • Lou Skunt

    I’ve made mention of this in the past (on another website, which shall remain nameless). I don’t want to be redundant, but it bears repeating, given today’s topic… Boys that have the good fortune to work with their fathers at an early age can also develop permanent positive attributes.

    My father was a chef from Italy and I grew up in the restaurant business. He showed me how to cook, bake, sharpen knives, butcher meat, garden, negotiate with suppliers, etc.. I watched him host large parties, interact with dignitaries and speak 5 languages.

    I also had a friend who’s German father was a plumber/electrician, another friend who’s German father was a home builder and another one was a Dutch dairy farmer. All of us would take part in spending quality time – learning from these men. When we got together, I remember the fathers always talking to each other with such reverence, and always well-dressed.

    I don’t know, maybe it was the time I grew up in (70’s-80’s), maybe it was part of that European/Immigrant mentality, because you don’t see it much these days, but you definitely learned proper work ethic and the ability to earn. Along with the self-confidence, you’re learning critical thinking, as well as how to improvise – all necessary skills to help you succeed and survive in this lifetime.

    • My father is a programmer, so there’s not a hell of a lot I could do to help him with his work when I was young. At home, though, he’d make me help with whatever home project he had on tap, from decorating/undecorating the house for holidays to picking up sticks and cones before mowing the lawn.

      Looking back, that was a good thing. He got the idea from helping his dad hang drywall as a boy.

      • Jim Johnson

        I’m in the same boat as an engineer. It helps out as he is getting older and I am able to show real life examples of the Algebra he is doing, I bought AutoCad software for home. But other than that, projects, working on cars, raising chickens, and volunteer work is the best I can do.

      • UnreconstructedConfederate

        Sticks and cones? You must be a southerner? I hate pine cones, if they are small enough to go under the mower I turn them into valuable organic matter.

        • Magnolias. Dense as rocks, great for chucking at people.

        • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

          plenty of sticks and cones up where my family is from too. I was just at my aunts house and she has this pine cone decoration thing she bought and I was like “you realize there are a few hundred pine cones like within 30 feet of us right”

          • UnreconstructedConfederate

            My wife used to do that, go buy some knick-knack fall decorations made with long leaf pine cones when there’s three truckloads of them in the yard. Now, I have no pine trees in my yard at all lol

      • Lou Skunt

        Even the smallest things can make a difference… I remember as a kid, pushing open my bedroom door too hard, only to realize that the doorknob went through the wall. My dad came in and looked at the hole in the wall; I was mortified, thinking he was going to beat my ass. He said: “come on, let’s go for a drive.” – He took me to the hardware store and purchased some patch and paint. He showed me how to fix the hole in the wall and paint the entire room…

    • bem

      My father did his damnedest to keep us away from his livelihood. He was a machinist and later a self-trained engineer at a small machine shop. He saw the writing on the wall and didn’t want us condemned to dying field. Kept telling us to learn about computers or some such nonsense….

      • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)
        • bem

          Right – I coulda learned to spit digital game to future robots with big dumpers! I just didn’t see the Big Picture (as promised by cartoons)!!!

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            and riveting?

          • Future career: sexbot technician.

            “Yep, there’s your problem. One of her rivets popped loose, and that’s why her left tit hangs down to her belly button.”

          • Murdoc34
        • Jim Johnson

          That right there is #1 reason to be interested in fembots.

          • cheeseburgercheeseburger

            huh? she is built like, no wait a minute, she IS a vacuum cleaner

          • Jim Johnson

            That’s right, a chick built expressly to do household chores. Getting them to want to have sex is the easy part.

    • UnreconstructedConfederate

      To listen to them would be an interesting way to spend some time, sounds like some cool cats.

      • Lou Skunt

        You know what, they were cool cats. Funny you mention that, because I really enjoyed listening to them. My friend, who’s dad was the electrician, always talked with my dad for extended periods. We would both just hang out and listen to them – very cool memories indeed.

  • UnreconstructedConfederate

    My daddy was a farmer, he passed away when I was fourteen but, I learned a lot from him like basic wrench turning, shooting, fishing, cleaning game, how to cook like a man and sharpen a knife.
    These days it’s seems knife sharpening is a lost art.

    • I saw a pretty neat sharpener a couple of days back. A YouTuber was playing with the Edge Pro knife sharpening system, which uses a simple lever setup to maintain a consistent angle.

      For my personal needs, a few swipes on a honer and the occasional back-and-forth on a grittier whetstone is more than enough, but it’s a neat little product.

      • UnreconstructedConfederate

        I still go old school with a whetstone too.

        • Not the best for adjusting the angle, and given my skill I’d hesitate to shave with any of my knives, but a whetstone and maybe a sharpening steel is about all you ever need.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            I’d have no problem sharpening a pocket knife, an axe or some utility blade by my kitchen knives? No way. Those I bring to a local sushi restaurant where they will sharpen them for 5 bucks a knife and then I hone them every time I use them.

          • I’ve got an acquaintance who smiths as a hobby. 4 out of 5 times he’ll sharpen my knives absolutely free, and the other time he charges a couple of bucks. When my blades need some quality work, he’s the guy I call.

          • John Galt

            “..by my kitchen knives? No way”.

            I was invited to dinner one night and the guy hosting was a butcher. I picked up a roll and wanted to cut it with a butter knife while cutting towards me. Right through the roll and right into my thumb. Blood all over the plate. I mean.. who the hell sharpens butter knives?

          • bem

            “while cutting towards me”
            tsk…..tsk…..tsk….
            You’ll never get your totin’ chip that way……

          • Ever seen that trick where you cut a carrot with a really sharp knife then stick the pieces back together and can’t tell where it was cut?

            I guess he does that with the butter.

          • Hipponax (μητροκοίτης)

            Lol

          • UnreconstructedConfederate

            That don’t sound like bad deal as long as they don’t leave any of that fish bait sushi on it when they give it back.

  • Henry VIII

    Attention please, colleague announcement.
    Could you all people please stop going “Pabst” in the comment section.
    Remember, this site is in its early days…chances are the software won’t be able to handle the large amount of unnecessary Youtube videos posted by reckless commenters.
    Thank you for your co-operation.

    • Jim Johnson

      I would like to know Cynic’s opinion on this. I know they did a recent upgrade, but how much of an upgrade I am unsure of.

    • bem

      DAMNIT! I had the PERFECT video to make this point clear….

      • Jim Johnson
  • AutomaticSlim

    Great idea.
    I consider myself a top expert on this topic and I will explain at the end of my post.

    A father should ensure his son should be taught the follow starting at a young age of 7 or 8 and progressing to young adulthood

    1) Fighting skills. Boxing or martial arts or wrestling training.

    2) Physical strength and athletic training. Start with pushups, bicycle crunches, squat thrusts, deep knee bends, swimming at a young age. Progress to dips, chinups/pullups, running/jogging from 12/13 or so. To weights after 15 or so.

    3) Automotive/Plumbing/Electrical/Carpentry training and practice. Teach your son to change the oil and tune the car. Replace faucets and toilets. Build sheds.

    4) Monitor his progress! Make sure he hangs out with a good group of guys and
    dates pretty girls who genuinely care about him. If you see problems it is YOUR JOB to step and and get them fixed. Don’t let your boy fall through the cracks!

    5) In his late teens, early twenties, make sure you start teaching him how to buy and manage real estate, perhaps even how to manage rental units. How to run a business. How to invest money in different financial instruments.

    6) And this is MOST important. Make sure you have an IRON-CLAD, IMMUTABLE WILL, so an evil WITCH of a mother (may her putrid soul rot in hell!) or a evil BITCH of a younger sister can’t conspire together to cut him out after you are gone.

    Now for the explanation of my claim as an expert. (Apologies for being redundant to those familiar with me from ROK).

    I am the EXACT NEGATIVE IMAGE of everything written above.
    My Ultra-Alpha father (Navy Office, golden gloves boxer, Mechanical Engineer from a top 5 engineering school, Business Owner, Landlord, and owner of 2 homes) NEVER TAUGHT ME A GODDAMN THING!!! Was too busy playing golf , banging his mistresses and avoiding the Wicked Witch of Westchester, and he let me fall through the cracks. I don’t hate my father (he’s been gone for 12 years), but he was useless to me. I most certainly will hate my mother for ALL eternity.

    Fathers, train your sons!
    Don’t let them end up like me!!!

    • Lou Skunt

      Solid post Slim! Amidst a sea of bullshit these days, your candor is refreshing – Much Respect, my friend!

      • AutomaticSlim

        Thanks Lou. Always like your posts as well. Take care.